It’s crazy how long it’s taken me to realise this, but I miss men. Ever since I had babies (so that’s 10 years worth of hardly noticing), there has been a severe man shortage in my life. Actually, I think it’s not so crazy that it’s taken me this long to notice, because I’m surrounded by the loveliest man on a day to day basis, BUT whatever happened to having men as friends?
Throughout my school days, uni days, working days and early-married days, I’ve had some really good blokey friends. Just kicking around with my male mates, much the same as I kicked around with the girls. The long conversations over many glasses of many things, loving the easy banter than men seem to do so well. I like men a lot. I like their opinions on things, I like their ability to forgive and forget, I like their playfulness and I like their willingness to admit that they are always more open, interesting and talkative when a girl is on the scene.
My life these days is all about the girls. I’m girl-empowered. I work with women, I hang out with women and even when we got to a function with actual real-live men present, the women and men never seem to hang out together. It’s so frustrating! The girls are in the lounge room and the boys are in the backyard. I feel like I’m back in Year 8 when we were all too shy to hurdle our hormones and talk to each other.
Why is it that ‘older’ men and women don’t hang out together? It’s mainly the parenting circuit where I find this curious behaviour. It’s so rampant these days that the few times I’ve ventured over to hang with the fellas, I’ve received weird looks and once, memorably, an admonishment to stop ‘flirting with my husband’ (because you’re flirting every time you stop to chat to a man, right?) (Besides, have you met your husband?). But it speaks volumes about why the men and women I know don’t hang out together very much. It’s taking me everything I’ve got not to write, “this has got nothing to do with my relationship with my husband, etc, etc, etc.” It’s not about that. It’s about this.
There’s a fellow parent who does the school run who just happens to be a man and he’s great value. I find myself talking to him more and more as other man options dwindle. He’s everything I want in a new man these days: uninterested but interesting. It was actually a conversation with Owen last week that made me look around and see all the many wonderful women in my life and think, “I miss men”. I really, really miss them and I have no idea how to get them back.
Are you similarly man challenged?
Amy says
Couple friends! When there’s 4 people and no more, it feels much less segregated. I like guy friends and I’m lucky enough that my girl friends are a bit the same, or that they just don’t notice the difference. I still find that in groups there tends to be the inside-outside (beer-mixers, kitchen-bbq, coffee table-pool table, living room-garage) split but hosting a small dinner party keeps everyone together and feels more inclusive.
Dinner parties should be a thing. They’re not, for me, but they should be!
Maxabella says
I totally agree that the smaller group is good, but that’s just hanging out with your mate’s husband or your husband’s friend’s wife… or something. I wan t my own buddy/s! x
Courtney says
Some of my closest friends at work were men. Now that I’m a SAHM I never see them!
Maxabella says
You see what I’m saying here? It’s so sad. x
Corinne says
I have the reverse problem – I don’t have enough women in my life. I grew up with 3 brothers, so feel very comfortable around men. All of my husband’s friends are equally my friends, when I went back to Australia without my husband I hung out with them on my own a lot. I email and message them as much I email “my” own friends. My husband and I have been together since we were 20 so most of our friends are ‘our’ friends (with a few exceptions). In Dubai, it’s not uncommon to be in a social situation where I’m the only female or one of two females. At school, I have some mum friends, but also have dad friends, for whatever reasons it seems that men do the school drop-off here than in Sydney (probably because school starts early at 7.30am so dads can drop off on their way to work).
I really need to up the ante on my female friendship circle though! Gotta get working on that.
Maxabella says
We could swap?
Helen K says
I actually feel that its not with the larger gatherings that this happens – we must have less segregation than it sounds like you do, for some reason (possibly because my husband is always in the kitchen at any gathering, regardless of whether it’s ours or not – gives him a purpose as otherwise he gets a bit shy. I therefore mingle a lot more than I might otherwise – I could have worse problems, I guess … ). I find I can have some really fascinating discussions and great relationships form, as we continue the conversation from the previous time next time – I don’t know, but nobody has given me, or them, the impression of any jealousy (does that say something about me? Not sure!) And we have lots of Dads at all the sporting comps, training sessions, etc – and lots of chatting takes place (particularly if we go out for dinner afterwards – in between controlling kids, of course), plus family gatherings – lots of male brothers / brothers in law, and so on. Work is (kind of) mixed for me – but to be honest, it’s now pretty rushed at work (not a lot of socialising, as we all try to get back to families – but that impacts on men and women equally).
For me, it’s the one on ones that no longer happen – if I’m catching up with anyone, or going for a walk, or a drink, it tends to be a girl friend. I’m not sure why (possibly the reasons above? or possibly the fact that time is limited so if we are going to catch up with anyone else, and its not ‘the girls for bookclub, a night out, etc’, then it should include partners as we don’t spend enough time together, certainly not without the kids around? I think that’s the reason, anyway). I find a lot of chatting on line though – and at this stage in life, that’s probably enough, really.
It also makes me aware in writing this that I don’t actually see any single, childless men outside of work colleagues (other than youngies – nephews or whatever) – making mental note to think about who I might be excluding just because I am not thinking / letting life carry us along unthinkingly. Hmmm.
Maxabella says
It’s those one on one chats that I miss the most. I certainly have plenty of random ‘how are you?’ chats with a variety of males, but no one to call a real ‘friend’. I adore one of my best friend’s husband and we really get along well, but it’s as a foursome, not as ‘my friend’. It’s a funny one… x
Trudie says
I have always, always, always had close male friends. I have three male friends in particular and we’ve all known each other for 30 odd years since year one in fact. When hubby and I started dating I told him he needed to meet the “boys” and be happy and comfortable with the fact that they would always be in my life or we wouldn’t have a relationship. He met the boys 20 years ago when we started dating and they all hit it off. I’m lucky, I’ve continued to have a develop friendships with other males in our relationship and marriage it’s never been a problem, hubby has close female friends. We have never put restrictions on each others friendships with the opposite sex and as a result we have wonderful close friendships with our friends men and women alike, as well as having a wonderful marriage where we share everything with one another. I don’t know where I’d feel without that balance of the fellas in my life.
Maxabella says
You’d probably feel a lot like me, I think Trudie! You are a very lucky indeed to have these wonderful male friendships. There are absolutely no restrictions put on me by my husband, nor me on him, but I think there is less opportunity to be social with males these days for me. x
eliza says
I get men acting like I’m flirting with them if I talk to them. I find this irritating as I’m so in love with my man. Plus, what, they think they’re that hot a woman couldn’t possibly just want to chat. So I’ve pretty much given up.
Maxabella says
I kinda wish I had this problem, Eliza (JK). Perhaps part of my man drought is coming from the men themselves? Maybe men don’t want to be a woman’s friend? x
Erin says
I do understand what you mean, I find men fascinating, they simply are fascinating, how they think, talk etc. But I’m lucky, with 5 brothers, not to mention the 8 b-i-l’s and the 11 nephews who with two of my own 6 sons are now joining the men category I have lots of men in my life. Some of our couple friends we’ve been friends with for nearly two decades so there is a special relationship with those men but yes it is more complicated…. guess aside from my husband and then sons by relationship with my bros is the specialist:)
Maxabella says
You’re lucky to come from such a marvellous family, Erin. x
BK says
I have three good male friends. One is married, two are long term bachelors. The Husband is cool with it. We are ‘couple friends’ with the married guy and his wife but I also see both him and his wife on their own from time to time. Of the other two male friends, one is an ex but that’s cool. In fact, married male friend and I were also together for all of about 5 minutes about 13-14 years ago but that is all in the long distant past and when it didn’t work out we snapped back into mates mode pretty fast (we had been mates for years beforehand).
Maxabella says
These are friendships to cherish, Bri. I have slowly list touch with my closer make friends from uni days. I think I might track them down via Facey… x
Marina says
Bron, you know my situation, but since recovering, man have I had an education (!) I’m confident I know the answer to this one. (It’s come ‘straight from the horse’s mouth’ so to speak, many times over, from married, single, and separated men, from all walks of life) and Eliza, you’re onto it…
Maxabella says
I agree that Eliza has a point! I guess I just wish it wasn’t so. It’s all very When Harry Met Sally!! x
Zanni says
I have always been man challenged. I went to a girls boarding school and most of my friends at uni were female. Actually I probably hang out with more men now more than ever as we have a good bunch of dads around us.
Maxabella says
Plenty of good dads here too, Zanni but it’s just not the same… x
Jo @Countrylifeexperiment says
I’m the only female in our staffroom. Surprisingly, I love it. They are great value for a laugh and always supportive.
Maxabella says
I think you are very lucky, Jo. x
Lisa@RandomActsOfZen says
Yes! I used to have lots of bloke friends when I was working, but now it’s only the dads that I see at school things. Lovely dads, but different to having mates.
When I go to John’s work functions I still catch up with them, but it’s not the same as being in a common work situation. I guess after 12 years, we don’t have that much in common any more.
And I love that you referenced Harry/Sally! I could easily watch this fabulous movie weekly and never get sick of it x
Maxabella says
I think I’m well overdue a WHMS rewatch, Lisa… x
Jenni says
I hear ya! I like my bloke friends too and have just spent time over summer catching up with them. Problem is I get jealous when my husband gets on with them too, I am a bit possessive of my bloke friends.
Fortunately I have quite a few around me at the moment through work, school and help with my kids so I have my bloke friend need satiated. So I understand totally, I don’t like it when life become too female centric either! You’ll have to put an ad in the paper, ha!
Maxabella says
Internet not-dating perhaps? x
Lisa Heidke says
I hear you, Bron. Given I work alone and write contemporary women’s fiction, when I’m not alone, I’m generally catching up with other women – writers, book club gals, school mums etc.
I do have 17 and 19 year old sons – and their male friends (they travel in packs) are constantly roaming my kitchen searching for food. Does that count or is it a tad creepy?
Maxabella says
Not creepy, but doesn’t count!! x
Ellen says
Do you know I had not considered this at all until I read this post but you are SO RIGHT. I worked in predominantly male work environments for years and always got along well with blokes. I’ve always enjoyed getting a man’s take on things and to be honest I think I think more like a man than a woman in many ways myself. These days I’m in mummy world both personally and professionally. Other than my husband, brother in law and Dad I hardly speak to men anymore.
And you’re right, there’s a weird male-female division that goes on in any social group larger than two couples. Hmmm, we need a support group for women who need men -but not in a creepy classifieds kind of way
Maxabella says
I think we are discovering a bit of a phenomenon here, Ellen. I wonder if it’s an exclusively ‘Aussie’ thing (I’m thinking BBQ here) or whether it’s just a parent thing. Either way, I want to work out how I can bring back the male buddies. x
Kelly Exeter says
I was at a wedding a couple of years ago where I was one of two women at a table full of men. And it reminded me how much I enjoy conversations with men. I mean, I love my girls! But I love the uncomplicated nature of male conversations too. And I too find myself wondering why do we separate off into men and women’s conversations at BBQs. I hate it!
Maxabella says
WHY do we do that!? I need to know!! x
Emily @ Have A Laugh On Me says
Bloody hell now that you mention it HELL YES! It’s so refreshing. I used to have THE BEST colleague when I was a journo. He was chief of staff and I was chief sub editor and we used to sit side by side from 6am til 6pm (at the earliest) and work our arses off but also talk and laugh – it was FUN! x
Maxabella says
Yep, that was my buddy John in my old job. We’re still in touch, but it just ain’t the same. x
Bele @ BlahBlah says
So, true! I must confess, I often find an excuse to go and hang out with the blokes at the BBQ just so I can chat to the guys for a bit, because I miss them too. Apparently, the French don’t do this gender segregation as much. Maybe, because no one gender will trust the other alone with the cheese x
Maxabella says
Heheheh! Or just ‘cos the French seem to have a pretty good idea about what makes a good life in general! x
JodiGibson (@JFGibsonWriter) says
Oh yes! I find it much easier to talk to men than women. Women are all pretentious to begin with, thinking they are being judged. Men are just casual and cool. And you can joke a lot more with men. I’m not one for bigger social functions but totally hate that it all ends up being segregated, I mean what’s the point?
I like going out with another couple, the conversations are all inclusive and it’s so much more fun.
Maxabella says
Yes and yes and yes and… yes! I guess I just want my own blokey buddies, not a ‘couple’ thing. I mean, I adore my husbie (there I go again), but why are all male friendships via him and with him? I want my own but it just doesn’t seem to be how it works when we get older. We just can’t seem to be able to make a true male friend. That’s my experience anyway. x
Emily says
I have felt like that (especially in the early days of parenting), but less so now. But as you may have noticed at Voices of 2014, I tend to do the opposite – in that big room full of mostly females, I latched onto the bank-talking male in the room! HA!
A lot of my friends are sharing the at-home responsibilities so I catch up with the blokes as often as the girls. And my ‘main’ friendship group (for want of a better term – the ones we see the most) includes my male friends from uni as well as the female, so we tend to mingle un-gender-specifically.
Except around the barbecue.
Maxabella says
Non-gender specific friendships are what I’m after. It’s been a while for me. x
Sonia from Sonia Styling says
I too used to have oodles of guy friends in my late teenage years/early twenties. Nowadays? They are all (originally) my husband’s mates who are in our friendship group. I’m lucky because if I ever need a dude’s opinion, I know I can call any one of the boys in our group and they will be there for me. And I’m sometimes the only wife/woman at get-togethers – and they are totally cool with that. I guess for me, it’s evolved into something different, merged with my life with my husband. x
Vicki @ Knocked Up and Abroad says
Yes, it has dwindled a little on the men front come to think of it. I still have a couple of close guys in my life that keep me dosed up. They’re such great buddies.
Sonia Life Love Hiccups says
I so hear you. Do you know that for 10 years from when I was 25 to 35 one of my best friends was a really hot guy and the bullshit people went on with about how we must have been having an affair or poor Carl was eventually the end of our friendship. I mean we are still friends, but we just no longer hang out together like we used to xx
Tash @ Gift Grapevine says
I used to have lots of guy friends in my uni and work days. My males friends are now part of couples although our couple friendship group has been around for a long time. It’s not so segregated at BBQs anymore! I always wanted a brother. I love the casual banter and incessant sport talk (I don’t have many girlfriends who are happy to talk Formula 1 or cricket). We have some great stay at home dads at school and I happily chat with them (more for feeling sorry because they look quite lonely standing by themselves at times!). I recommend checking out some of the great dad bloggers on the interwebs. There are some great guys who write well and will happily chat away – might make you feel less man-challenged 🙂